Are the tokens on rumors an issue?

From what I'm seeing so far, it seems quests generally tend to not have on Rumors, but generally tend to have it on Questor. This makes sense to me, since the rumors is in the Talk UI, while the Questor is a popup.
Your changes seems to remove them on both Rumors and Questor, though. Was it intended to remove them from Questor? Also, should we do a pass and remove from all rumors?

This makes sense to me, since the rumors is in the Talk UI, while the Questor is a popup.

The questor only gives a popup message if it's invoked in a quest action like "say" or "givepcreward." The messages "QuestorPostfailure" and "QuestorPostsuccess" only appear if you enter the Talk UI with the questgiver after the quest ends. A lot of them are misformatted, and I haven't fixed them.

For the other questions, I need some more clarification on them.

After discussing offline, it seems any "Talk UI" message on multiple lines does not get displayed properly. This is an issue with many quests in the game. We might wanna just fix them all

Are you saying that RumorsDuringQuest, RumorsPostfailure, RumorsPostsuccess, QuestorPostsuccess, and QuestorPostfailure only ever displayed in dialog interface, and that all 5 sections do not need formatting?

Btw, there are say QuestorPostsuccess in S0000003, and say QuestorPostfailure in S0000013

Yes, those five fields only are used in the Talk UI. Kab tested it earlier today, and <ce> lines and multiple-line formatting do not interfere with their appearance inside the Talk UI; the message is displayed fine.

Finding Questor messages in the main quest is odd but that's classic Daggerfall data. No doubt one of many things they changed during development.

Yes I want to be on record that after testing offline, the Talk UI does handle this, by simply replacing tokens with spaces. Gonna run the PR locally to see what the tutorial looks like in action now before approving

I've read this thread a couple of times and I am still confused. Are formatting tags like an issue for rumors / postsuccess etc message that are used in talk window really an issue? I'd like to know because I have 2 blocks like that in my R&R quest.

@ajrb In my tests, no. When I initially reported this, this was based on my conversation with JayH, but after that conversation, I was not able to reproduce the issue. We're moving forward as if it's not an issue. However, I still think it's better if new quests avoid using on Talk text, simply before it's not used and can lead to confusion when reading the quest

I think I'd like to prioritize this for 1.1. The earlier we release this, the more feedback we can get. However, I think this could be a controversial change, if it were to be less useful than the original. Maybe some purists won't like it, but this can probably be modded back in easily.

I'll test it myself, and maybe we could playtest it on Lysandus' Tomb?

Some feedback on the Tutorial quest

• The swing type can be changed anytime in Controls -> Advanced. I'd remove mention of the title screen, to avoid having people restart the game to change swing type. Just mention that after Controls, it's under Advanced
• Is there supposed to be a Yes No?

• Along with the first one, I find 5 seconds for a call to action might be a bit short. I'm worried someone will start looking at their keyboard for too long, and then the next tutorial will start. It's not like the user is stuck waiting, I think it's fine to have slightly longer waits. 15 seconds on could be fine. I guess we could playtest it and adjust.

• Not sure about the phrasing on the saving throws. Yes, some enemies have less than 50% on their saving throws, but I don't want to make it seem like magic is only meant to be used against them. Having half your spells miss is how magic is expected to work. Maybe just mention that it's normal for half of your spells to miss.

• Not sure about the suggestion of Daggerfall. Gothway Garden is an iconic entry town. Pretty arbitrary I suppose

• Knightly Orders are also unique, might be worth mentioning

• The tutorial avoids mentioning hotkeys for the most part. I kind of get why you do it here, but worth considering that they might have been changed

• Yay

Overall, I'm kind of okay with the short timers on messages. I get it might be better to just get them over with. Just one thing, is that I find it pretty difficult to get the RumorsDuringQuest messages with your version. Do you think we could replace them with RumorsPostSuccess? You'd get helper tips for 7 days after reading all of it. You still get the basic plot hooks if you said No to the quest (assuming you make it to a city in 7 days).

Okay, sounds good. Most of those are small changes, not hard to do. The reason I chose Daggerfall City is because it's the only place with a permanent location in the region of Daggerfall, so I thought I could do a "when enters" condition on it, but even that failed, so I changed it to "any city." I'll have to look up what location Gothway Garden is.

Information I like from the original that I see missing here.

Object activation and loot piles

• At least the part about activating the door and telling users to check corpses for loot
• Page 9 does tell you about activating the throne later on, but I feel the first door and basic loot piles are essential to mention early

Inventory window

• A bit more awkward since messages go by so far, you'd get this prompt before you actually found it. Maybe it's fine

The reason I chose Daggerfall City is because it's the only place with a permanent location in the region of Daggerfall

Yeah to be fair so did the original. My bad, it's fine like this

Good points, I'm fine with them. I'll try to find a chance to change them.

It's too bad I'm only learning about this now. A lot of QP1 would probably have the same problem. But for this I think it's fixed, I tested every window in-game on non-SDF now.

Much better. I still wish the message boxes would fit inside retro frames, but maybe we need a tool to detect and message sizes in quests instead. We'll go with this for now

I don't know how much additional work was going to be put into this, but as an FYI I've proofread all of the quest files and intend to do a PR for them if/when my current PR is approved.
I'll work my changes around these, however that'll be easier if fewer quest files have typos fixed here.

I don't intend to add anything else to this PR, unless someone finds a game-breaking bug of some kind. It's easier on Kab to let this one settle, so it doesn't have to get approved again.

I'll defer to the other maintainers on the question of text fixes.